Might get a new Elemental Shape !!!

[purtellfr]

Druid Elemental Shape gains Shadow Elemental as their 5th subradial choice.

Elder version:
Str: 22
Dex: 22
Con: 18
Dmg: 2d6 + 6d6 Cold
Base AC: 10
Size AC: -2
Dex AC: 6
Natural AC: 0
Total AC: 14 + Cha mod
Bonuses: Deflection AC bonus equal to Charisma modifier, DR 10/Magic, SR = 10 + Character Level, Elemental Immunities, 50% concealment, +20 AB bonus (+16 for the 16 HD version)

It's a low AC, high BAB, high damage, high mitigation form.

Might get it with V1.38.

Hope it gets in...

[nicethugbert]

What do druids have to do with shadows? Nothing that I can see.

[Beldar]

Aren't shadows part of the natural world NTB? I cast a shadow.

Calling shadows an element? Not so much (maybe they are a semiconductor?)

Fire can burn you, water can drown you, earth can crush you, air can blow you around (lame)...

Shadow can creep you out?

[Kaedrin]

"Shadow elementals are creatures of living shade, brought into being from the stuff of the Plane of Shadow. Appearing as nebulous forms of ever-shifting gloom, they lash out at living creatures with smoky tendrils as insubstantial as the darkness."

They are elementals just like fire or water.

"When confronting a threat or light-bearing creatures, shadow elementals slash at foes with freezing tendrils of absolute darkness."

I'm still undecided on this one.

[wettshoes]

I think this elemental shape would be consistent with what i see as a druid/shifter. I would vote yes for this elemental form.

[Kaedrin]

The other elemental forms I was looking at are Ember Guard and Tempest

Ember Guard
Str: 30
Dex: 15
Con: 30
Dmg: 1d10 + 1d6 Fire
Base AC: 10
Size AC: -2
Dex AC: 2
Natural AC: 23
Total AC: 33
Bonuses: Fast Healing 5, Immune to Fire, Immune to Poison, Elemental Immunities, DR 15/Good, permanent Aura of the Sun, SR 23, Resist Acid 10, Resist Cold 10, eventually a 6d6 fire cone + slow effect on a 4 round cooldown (needs gui support)

Tempest
Str: 29
Dex: 6
Con: 28
Dmg: 2d8
Base AC: 10
Size AC: -4
Dex AC: -2
Natural AC: 10
Total AC: 24
Bonuses: Permanent Aura of the Sun, Fire Immunity, Elemental Immunities, Cold Vulnerability, +10 Deflection AC bonus, DR 15

[nicethugbert]

If WotC found a rational, that's one thing. But, as far as I know Druids are connected to the Prime Material and Elemental Planes, the Elemental Planes being the building blocks for the Prime Material Plane. That is the old "common sense" view of this.

Shadow is the absence of light. The Plane of Shadow is akin to the undead. It is a pale version of life. It is "unnatural".

Druids have an indirect connection with light through the sun which most plants need to live. They don't control sunlight, only the clouds and elements that might obscure it. They don't have much if any power over the other fantasy energies such as negative, positive, or divine. Their emphasis is life and the elements.

I would prefer to sharpen that distinction or else we have too much similarity between the classes.

[Kaedrin]

That's not how WotC interprets the Shadow Plane for 3.5e. Shadow Magic is linked intrinsically with standard magic and the shadow plane is a dark reflection of the material plane. It makes sense for the corrupted forests of the Mere to give birth the shadowy beings and portals to the shadow plane. If the land itself becomes shadowed, then it's champions would be corrupted as well. It's almost perfect for NE Druids.

"The Plane of Shadow neighbors and overlaps the Material Plane, and many of the others as well. It is a dark, twisted reflection of the real world, made all the more alien by its nagging similarities. Color is a faded memory, bleached from the world and replaced with shades of gray...

The Plane of Shadow is the literal shadow of the Material Plane, cast not by any light but by the mystical energies that hold creation together. The domain containts twisted reflections of everything that exists in the physical realm..."

[mammothtruk]

plane of darkness vs plane of negative energy NTB.

while the plane of darkness has undead according to the books the negative energy plane is where they are linked.

And even in 2nd edition they had shadow elementals. They also had salt elementals witch were beyond the cool.

[nicethugbert]

Key words: "dark, twisted reflection", corrupted. Is there any WotC material for a connection between Druids and the Shadow Plane? From the description, I don't see Druids drawing power from there. They may be able to enter it and operate in it. But, who would grant them shadow powers/energies? Malar has no connection to the Shadow Plane. He's just the brutal, bloody, murderous side of nature.

[Kaedrin]

Firefox crashed on me so the very long and detailed sections I typed up from the sourcebook are gone. Suffice it to say, you are incorrect. Read/Buy the Tome of Magic as it focuses/details the Shadow Plane and it's interactions. It specifically mentions rangers and druids in the material and even dark versions of nature's creatures.

Your vision of it may differ, but the WotC version does not (which is EXACTLY where I'm getting this from).

It's ingrained heart and soul in the forgotten realms (Weave vs Shadow Weave). It's also had it's precedent set WAY back to the first FR novel, Darkwalker on Moonshae where an aspect of Malar (love the irony here) called Kazgoroth corrupted and twisted the power of nature against the Earthmother. No, he wasn't a shadow deity or aspect but he did use darkness, necromancy, and general corrupt to use nature against itself. The fact a druid can be NE practially screams that not everyone is your tree hugging peace pipe smoking hippy.

[mammothtruk]

well from that point of view it gets different depending on the book and the person reading it. Shadow Weave magic can be accessed by druids. And depending on the book and rules you read that shadow weave is either controlled by Shar completely or somewhat or funneling shadow plane power. Also depending on the PRC you read druids can and can not access the plane of shadows powers or alters it.

Its all very relative depending on the person, book, and setting. However as a general rule from the base books about the planes the plane of shadow is no different than any other elemental plane. So in theory druids should have access and is what they use for illusion spells, but thats all based on assuming the DM agrees on that view based on setting. FR says to access the plane of shadow for magic of any kind you have to go through the shadow weave... or? something to that effect. It had a lot to do with the settings in 3.5 and was confusing.

[nicethugbert]

I have ToM. The only reference I see to Druids is mention that Druids rarely take up a certain prestige class from that book. Forgot which one. Clearly, the mechanism exists for Druids to take a number of PrCs from that book. It is not expressly forbidden. But, there is no mention of what happens to a druid once he takes one of those PrCs. The sections leaves much to be determined. There are only clues similar to the language which states the opposition between druids and undead.

Although, druids may be NE, they maintain their opposition to the undead, etc. And, Malar is a deity. Many deities have factions or orders within their "churches". In FR, Druids must have a Nature Patron Deity. None of the nature deities have a connection to the shadow plane that I am aware of.

It is not clear why a Shadow Elemental is called an elemental as the plane of shadow is not an elemental plane. It raises the possibility that there are elementals for all planes and that the term elemental is ambiguous.

Perhaps this is an opportunity for an elemental pack. Although, it all risks becoming just semantics.