|
|
Post by cosper123 on Feb 6, 2009 10:50:16 GMT -5
Soooo, I'm building a monk.
SF/Cleric/monk
Was thinking of throwing in some hospitaler to boost BAB and cleric progression.
Would that be of benefit, or does the bonus from Greater Flurry as it progresses past level 11 offset the bonus of the extra BAB Hospitaler will grant me???
|
|
|
|
Post by Loudent2 on Feb 6, 2009 13:40:19 GMT -5
Depends, are you making a monk with some cleric abilities or are you going for full cleric spell casting?
If you're going to have 11 monk levels at the very least then I can't see how hospitoler is going to help all that much. At the bare minimum:
monk 11/c1/SF 10 means that you have 8 levels to play with. Since Hosp brings mostly BAB with a loss of some spell casting you might as well bring cleric up to 4, giving you 5 levels to play with and a BAB of 21. 5 Hosp at this point will bring you 3 casting levels (level 8 spells max) and BAB of 26. On the other hand adding 5 levels straight to cleric will bring you to level 9 spells and a BAB of 24. Even if you're not going to progress Monk, you're still better off with Straigth cleric rather than Hosp.
The question is: is it worth it to take monk up and sacrafice the cleric levels. That monk will give you some spell resistance, 1 better AC, quivering palm, a slightly higher BAB, slightly better fist damage, one extra attack and adamantine fists. The adamantine fists are probably the biggest benefit as you get higher up in levels a lot of things are going to have premonition type spells going or damage resistance that requires adamantine to bypass.
Let's see monk 16/cl 4/SF 10 has a BAB of 25, fist damage of 3d8. Level 6 spells with a caster level of 12, 26 SR, 5 attacks, AC bonus 3.
Monk 11/cleric 9/SF10 will have a bab of 24, 2d10 fist damage, level 9 spells with a caster level of 17 (21 with practiced). If you have holy warrior then your damage is also increased by 3 (IIRC) since you have level 9 spells. Or you can use the slot for persistanc haste.
Monk 11/cleric 4/SF 10/Hosp 5 has a BAB of 26, 2d10 fist dmage, level 8 spells with a caster level of 15 (19 with PS).
Of these, the second one is the most attractive, but that can't be helped. Clerics are just awesome that way and you almost always do better by adding cleric casting ability than anything else. Still I would take the first over the third.
|
|
|
|
Post by Beldar on Feb 6, 2009 15:09:06 GMT -5
The 26 BAB build gets you another attack per round. The thing is if you can cast Divine Power then you get the same number of attacks (and indeed BAB is immaterial since DP gives BAB 30 at level 30). If you plan to fight unbuffed (i.e. dispelled?), then hospitaler is helpful. My inclination would be to favor the 11 Monk/ 9 cleric / 10 SF variant - that is the one I picked. The power of the cleric spells outweighs the unbuffed strength of hospitaler.
|
|
|
|
Post by cosper123 on Feb 8, 2009 21:18:14 GMT -5
Hmm..anything in level eight cleric spells that triggers holy warrior?
Was thinking of -CotW 2/Cleric 7/SF10/Monk11 and pumping dex and wisdom. But according to Lou there is something along the lines of weapon finesse coming up for wisdom....so perhaps CotW isn't really worth it and I should just pump Wisdom and Str?
Considering I can't wear dex bracers CoTW is looking less and less appealing...but every addition to damage and AC is going to help.
|
|
|
|
Post by shoujo on Feb 8, 2009 21:40:54 GMT -5
You shouldn't be able to add CotW's dex damage to unarmed attacks/kamas I believe.
Also wouldn't get too excited about the wis to AB feat. With cleric buffs, you'll probably be close to the 20 AB cap so you won't get as much AB as you should.
|
|
|
|
Post by Loudent2 on Feb 8, 2009 21:52:45 GMT -5
Couple of points, I belive CoTW only applies to longsword, rapier, scimitar or universal sword. Since rapier is the only one you can finesse it makes the most sense. It would be great if you could add it to any weapoin you could finiesse.
The main cleric buff, divine power, changes your BAB, not your AB and does not count toward the 20 cap. Nor does the strength bonus, any of the weapon focus feats, enhancements on weapons and so forth. It's actually pretty difficult to get to the +20 AB as a cleric until your able to persist all those lower level spells. But, even the, it''s not as easy as you might think.
|
|
|
|
Post by shoujo on Feb 8, 2009 22:23:50 GMT -5
Enhancement bonuses on weapons do count towards the cap. At level 27, my bard/swift hits the +20 AB cap despite only having +15 AB's worth of buffs. Only way to account for that difference is her +5 warhammer.
A cleric would likely have something like
+5 weapon
+3 divine favor
+1 prayer
+1 bless
+1 aid
+2 battletide
+3 recitation
+16 AB total
This basically means you'll only get about 4 AB from intuitive strike and you can get that much with 18 dex.
|
|
|
|
Post by cosper123 on Feb 9, 2009 1:36:17 GMT -5
You shouldn't be able to add CotW's dex damage to unarmed attacks/kamas I believe. Also wouldn't get too excited about the wis to AB feat. With cleric buffs, you'll probably be close to the 20 AB cap so you won't get as much AB as you should. Ahh yeah duh keep forgetting CotW doesn't work for everything, lol. |
|
|
|
Post by mammothtruk on Feb 9, 2009 11:13:57 GMT -5
it will for short swords who have exotic weapon prof soon
|
|
|
|
Post by cosper123 on Feb 9, 2009 12:29:54 GMT -5
So can we add the elemental runes to gloves or is Lou still working on that?
|
|
|
|
Post by Loudent2 on Feb 9, 2009 12:41:18 GMT -5
You've always been able to add elemental runes to gloves.
|
|
|
|
Post by cosper123 on Feb 9, 2009 12:57:28 GMT -5
Awesome, I must have been confused by something else you said. Now I gotta go check older posts to figure out what I was thinking. Or mis-thinking...whatever.
|
|
|
|
Post by Loudent2 on Feb 9, 2009 14:33:34 GMT -5
you were probably thinking about having enhancement runes add enhancement and not AB
|
|
|
|
Post by cosper123 on Feb 9, 2009 16:45:14 GMT -5
Ok so in a desparate attempt to make this build unique I have come up with-
SL8/Cleric 1/SF10/Monk11
Stormlord? Are you mad? Why yes, thank you for asking. However...again, just looking to put a unique twist on this guy.
It'll progress my cleric levels, and although SF frowns on weapons it'll still be a nice backup if I have to fall back during a battle or to soften up an enemy from afar (since the SL damage bonus applies to shuriken).
|
|
|
|
Post by cosper123 on Feb 9, 2009 16:46:36 GMT -5
you were probably thinking about having enhancement runes add enhancement and not AB Ahh yeah that was it! Here's to hoping that gets in soon! That'd be awesome. Too many awesome ideas Lou, I can now somewhat understand all those annoying "NEAT!" posts that NTB makes... |
|
